Hello my fellow Minstrels who are going to do the miserable Auto-train leveling on launch. I have done some testing and I discovered something I don't think many people know. You can spec in instruments AND still autotrain. It's a bit hard to explain but I planned to auto-train until level 40 so that my final spec would be 33 stealth, 50 instruments, 29 slash. This spec would leave me with exactly 9 points left over. What I discovered is at level 5 I can add those left over 9 points into instruments allowing me to get speed + 2 DD's earlier and STILL Auto-Train to 40 with the spec 33 stealth, 50 instruments, 29 slash leaving me with exactly 0 points left over!

You may be thinking, "but what happens when I hit 24 and I don't get the pet charm spell?" Well, I tested that too and I still got the pet charm spell at 24. Basically there is no reason what-so-ever to not spec 9 points into instruments at level 5 to make the grind easier if you were planning to auto-train to 40. You can also still spec 44 thrust 50 inst if you wanted to, or 25 stealth, 36 slash 50 instruments.

Cheers.

Edit: Further elaboration:

This is not a bug at all. What you are doing is only electing out of the level 8, 12 and 16 points. Your first auto train will happen at 20 and then 24 just as normal auto-training occurs. Once you ding 40 you will have exactly 45 auto-train points instead of 54 allowing you to spec exactly how you wanted to and making the 5-16 levels a lot easier to handle.

as soon as you spec any point in the autotrain line the autotrain stops or is a bug that must be reported

Ilerget wrote:as soon as you spec any point in the autotrain line the autotrain stops or is a bug that must be reported

Not true.

Autotraining is coded in to keep these certain skills at exactly 1/4 of your level at all times.. If you bring 11 points points into Instruments at 47 and ding 48 it brings you up to 12 and awards 12 points only keeping you at 1/4 of what it should be. This is not a bug, it's just that nobody utilized it as it's basically useless except in this one situation and the benefits are hardly noteworthy.

Autotrain levels are: 8 12 16 20 24 28 32 36 40 44 48
Bonus points granted: 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12

If you added points to the autotraining line the autotrain SHOULD stop and don't give you this free points, if still do it is a bug

Ilerget wrote:If you added points to the autotraining line the autotrain SHOULD stop and don't give you this free points, if still do it is a bug

Here is everything you need to know about auto-training:

viewtopic.php?f=65&t=13665

"Q. "I have trained in longbow on my scout but I am only lvl 12, can I still autotrain?""
"A. Yes, however you won't get the full value of your autotrain, when you respec your longbow skill will be stuck at 3 longbow (check list of lvl/autoskill) that means your autotrain will continue from 3 and forward, meaning that at lvl 16 it will autoskill from 3->4 and so forth"

Kaudo wrote:Here is everything you need to know about auto-training:

viewtopic.php?f=65&t=13665

"Q. "I have trained in longbow on my scout but I am only lvl 12, can I still autotrain?""
"A. Yes, however you won't get the full value of your autotrain, when you respec your longbow skill will be stuck at 3 longbow (check list of lvl/autoskill) that means your autotrain will continue from 3 and forward, meaning that at lvl 16 it will autoskill from 3->4 and so forth"

In Uth1 I played alb and FULLY autotrained all classes that can be autotrained (yes, pala and minstrel too ).

Your quote is missing that you can continue the autotrain AFTER a respec of the autotraining line and that points stuck after respec are not for free, this is what your quote refers when it says that you "won't get the full value".

Ilerget wrote:Your quote is missing that you can continue the autotrain AFTER a respec of the autotraining line and that points stuck after respec are not for free, this is what your quote refers when it says that you "won't get the full value".

The reason he is saying you need to respec is because it assumes you passed the 1/4th of your level mark and therefore will not be awarded the points. Putting one point into the skill line forfeits the 8th level, two points forfeits the 12th level and so forth. This is not a bug at all. The reason the respec stone works as a work around is because it puts your character back under the 1/4th requirement to qualify for the free point.

It's really simple:

Every 4th level (beginning at 8 ) there is a check which goes:

"does the player have X skill?" (i.e. min 3 stealth)
If yes -> do nothing
if no -> raise it by 1

I'm not good explaining things to others sry.

Kaudo wrote:"Q. "I have trained in longbow on my scout but I am only lvl 12, can I still autotrain?""
"A. Yes, however you won't get the full value of your autotrain, when you respec your longbow skill will be stuck at 3 longbow (check list of lvl/autoskill) that means your autotrain will continue from 3 and forward, meaning that at lvl 16 it will autoskill from 3->4 and so forth"

Let's follow this scenario, you get free points in the next hot spots:


level 8 -> 2 NOT FREE
level 12 -> 3 NOT FREE
level 16 -> 4 free
level 20 -> 5 free
level 24 -> 6 free
level 28 -> 7 free
level 32 -> 8 free
level 36 -> 9 free
level 40 -> 10 free
level 44 -> 11 free
level 48 -> 12 free

You didn't autotrain at the start and used a respec at level 12, the starting 5 points in your autotrain line aren't free, the other autotrain points after the respec are free again giving you 72 free autotrain points.

If you want to spec 50 instrus, 33 stealth and 29 slash you need 45 free points from autotraining. You can respec just before level 32 and autotrain from that point. Full autotrain will let you take slash to 30.

sry for misunderstandings

Did not realize this either - I thought it was only dependent on if you had ever trained. Thank you! I may actually auto train now.

Pretty cool find. So instead of having 0 in instruments for 40 levels you will have 4 into instruments for the grey dds and grey speed. It will help a bit from 5-10 i guess, but the grey dds and grey speed won't really matter once you hit lvl 15ish and above as they will get resisted and groups will have green+ speed.

Unless you have some good friends willing to carry you from essentially lvl 15-40 i'm not sure how you can AT your first character at launch. Trust me, when you are lfg it wont take long for you to get blacklisted as the AT'ing minstrel lol. I may just make my stealth minstrel as my 2nd char and get him PL'd to 50 and bypass all this.

EDIT: Oh and by the way, not sure when you played beta but they changed the way XP worked like 3 or so months into beta. Basically the devs saw lvl 30-40 was too fast and lvl 40-50 was too slow. Once you hit 40 it felt like a brick wall. So they adjusted it to make lvl 30-40 take more xp and lvl 40-50 take less xp in effect making the xp curve more smooth. I feel like A LOT of people lvl'd from 30-40 when it was fairly easy during the first few months only to stop after they hit the brick wall at 40+. And then others didn't even grind lvls and just came for the i30 and i50. So if you only lvl'd in the first few months of beta, be prepared for a longer 30-40 at launch!

always is harder the last part of the grind, I would AT at the beginning and have max instrus in the hard part of the grind

Ardri wrote:Pretty cool find. So instead of having 0 in instruments for 40 levels you will have 4 into instruments for the grey dds and grey speed. It will help a bit from 5-10 i guess, but the grey dds and grey speed won't really matter once you hit lvl 15ish and above as they will get resisted and groups will have green+ speed.

Unless you have some good friends willing to carry you from essentially lvl 15-40 i'm not sure how you can AT your first character at launch. Trust me, when you are lfg it wont take long for you to get blacklisted as the AT'ing minstrel lol. I may just make my stealth minstrel as my 2nd char and get him PL'd to 50 and bypass all this.

EDIT: Oh and by the way, not sure when you played beta but they changed the way XP worked like 3 or so months into beta. Basically the devs saw lvl 30-40 was too fast and lvl 40-50 was too slow. Once you hit 40 it felt like a brick wall. So they adjusted it to make lvl 30-40 take more xp and lvl 40-50 take less xp in effect making the xp curve more smooth. I feel like A LOT of people lvl'd from 30-40 when it was fairly easy during the first few months only to stop after they hit the brick wall at 40+. And then others didn't even grind lvls and just came for the i30 and i50. So if you only lvl'd in the first few months of beta, be prepared for a longer 30-40 at launch!

I played 1 - 50 twice on the beta. Once at the start ( I was one of the first couple of 50's) and again about a month later on a new realm.

Also, as you auto-train you get new spells in those skills like charm pet at 24. I just brought this method up to so that level 5 - 24 are a lot easier.

Kaudo wrote:

Ardri wrote:Pretty cool find. So instead of having 0 in instruments for 40 levels you will have 4 into instruments for the grey dds and grey speed. It will help a bit from 5-10 i guess, but the grey dds and grey speed won't really matter once you hit lvl 15ish and above as they will get resisted and groups will have green+ speed.

Unless you have some good friends willing to carry you from essentially lvl 15-40 i'm not sure how you can AT your first character at launch. Trust me, when you are lfg it wont take long for you to get blacklisted as the AT'ing minstrel lol. I may just make my stealth minstrel as my 2nd char and get him PL'd to 50 and bypass all this.

EDIT: Oh and by the way, not sure when you played beta but they changed the way XP worked like 3 or so months into beta. Basically the devs saw lvl 30-40 was too fast and lvl 40-50 was too slow. Once you hit 40 it felt like a brick wall. So they adjusted it to make lvl 30-40 take more xp and lvl 40-50 take less xp in effect making the xp curve more smooth. I feel like A LOT of people lvl'd from 30-40 when it was fairly easy during the first few months only to stop after they hit the brick wall at 40+. And then others didn't even grind lvls and just came for the i30 and i50. So if you only lvl'd in the first few months of beta, be prepared for a longer 30-40 at launch!

I played 1 - 50 twice on the beta. Once at the start ( I was one of the first couple of 50's) and again about a month later on a new realm.

Also, as you auto-train you get new spells in those skills like charm pet at 24. I just brought this method up to so that level 5 - 24 are a lot easier.

Yea you get the grey lvl 6 charm pet at lvl 24 woooo . Not disagreeing with you, just saying 15-40 is gonna be hard.

Kaudo wrote:This is not a bug at all. What you are doing is only electing out of the level 8, 12 and 16 points. Your first auto train will happen at 20 and then 24 just as normal auto-training occurs. Once you ding 40 you will have exactly 45 auto-train points instead of 54 allowing you to spec exactly how you wanted to and making the 5-16 levels a lot easier to handle.

It's a bug if you didn't respec before hitting 20. And congratulations, you have found a new way to gimp your minstrel just to have grey DD's and speed a bit earlier. You know tasks are the fastest way to 20 right? Those grey DD's will not help with killing task targets at your level at all and grey speed comes at level 12 if you AT anyway. Those points in inst will also have no use in a group killing red/purp mobs. If you are not going for 6 inst for the first charm at least, you sacrifice 9 more points for no benefit.