Uthgard • View topic - twohand bonus and parry

twohand bonus and parry

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Satz Alerion Knight Posts: 1860 Joined: Jun 21, 2005 00:00 Location: Albion	Reply with quote by Satz » Mar 04, 2010 17:37 Blue wrote: Nymeros wrote:Do 2H weapons halve Parry on Uthgard? Confirmed? I hear that the first time. Is it this way on live? Or is Satz joking? You kidding, right? Ive looked up the releasenotes, and here you go, just by reading this, one might get the idea how it worked before 1.87. Shield - A character's chance to block will no longer be penalized when facing a character who is dual wielding. Parry - A character's chance to Parry will no longer be penalized when facing a character who is wielding a two handed weapon. - The penalty to parry when facing multiple attackers has been greatly reduced. Evade - A character's chance to evade will no longer be penalized when facing a character who is dual wielding. http://www.camelotherald.com/article.php?id=402 Just below the craft change notes. Last edited by Satz on Mar 04, 2010 17:39, edited 1 time in total.

Razzer Eagle Knight Posts: 913 Joined: Jul 04, 2009 00:00 Location: Behind Enemy Lines	Reply with quote by Razzer » Mar 04, 2010 17:39 This is basic I think it's implemented in DOL. From Grab Bag: "Dual wielders throw an extra wrinkle in. You have half the chance of shield blocking a dual wielder as you do a player using only one weapon. Your chance to parry is halved if you are facing a two handed weapon, as opposed to a one handed weapon." Uthgard till 2003!

Toblerone Banned Posts: 1071 Joined: Jan 27, 2010 01:00 Location: Croatia	Reply with quote by Toblerone » Mar 04, 2010 19:40 Blue wrote: Toblerone wrote:No it doesn't work, 2h damage is pathetic. It does work. So there's another reason why 2h damage is so low compared to 1h ? I thought it was because the 2h bonus is missing. Or it was missing and you fixed it in the past few days. [23:53] <@ref^> i once hugged a girl you know [20:03] <@ref^^> I AM NOT STUPID [20:03] <@ref^^> but i am retardd

Blue Developer Posts: 15821 Joined: Apr 22, 2005 00:00	Reply with quote by Blue » Mar 04, 2010 19:42 Its implemented on Uthgard. In DOL its not or was removed. What I find interesting when looking at the parry code is that there is a penalty on parry when facing dual wielders. From the patch notes and grab bag it looks to me that dual wield should penalize evade and block only. Any ideas or sources/proof? @Toblerone: 2H bonus is in for quite some time. It can also be checked with debug output. It should be visible on damage cap and damage in general, when using same DPS and SPD. It's done when it's done. Thanks for your patience. Every bug gets fixed. Sooner or later. "It is an inescapable law of nature that the amount of satisfaction one gains from achieving something is related to how hard it is and easy things can only elicit a fleeting superficial sort of pleasure." Blue says, "you used macro tools or macro keyboard" Pala says, "i am disabled. and i have a mechanic left hand that can be programed. its hard to play woith one hand" [Appeal] Bxxxxxxxx: "why is RA first aid cann man i stealth use and not unstealth cann man ra if man use unstealth ?????????" BannedUser: "i was not using automate game action my hand was fall on keyboard during i was sleep .... i was completly fall on keyboard ..."

Toblerone Banned Posts: 1071 Joined: Jan 27, 2010 01:00 Location: Croatia	Reply with quote by Toblerone » Mar 04, 2010 19:43 Uh that's quite the opposite. Parry chance should be increased when facing dual weilders, just like evade and block are lowered. I dunno about 2h bonus, even if it is in there's something terribly wrong with the damage of 2h weapons. I cry when I hit for 200ish with a fully buffed hero with 50+17 LW ^^ Last edited by Toblerone on Mar 04, 2010 19:47, edited 1 time in total. [23:53] <@ref^> i once hugged a girl you know [20:03] <@ref^^> I AM NOT STUPID [20:03] <@ref^^> but i am retardd

Neju Eagle Knight Posts: 893 Joined: Sep 11, 2009 00:00	Reply with quote by Neju » Mar 04, 2010 19:44 http://roclar.net/DAoC/info.php#Melee gives pretty good info on melee mechanics I two-shot Zerkers

nixian Forum Moderator Posts: 5450 Joined: May 19, 2006 00:00	Reply with quote by nixian » Mar 04, 2010 19:45 Neju wrote:http://roclar.net/DAoC/info.php#Melee gives pretty good info on melee mechanics Parry Your chance to parry is affected by the number of attackers, the size of the weapon you're using, and your spec in parry. Parry % = (5% + 0.5% * Parry) / # of Attackers Parry: (((Dex2)-100)/40)+(Parry/2)+(Mastery of P3)+5. < Possible relation to buffs So, if you have parry of 20 you will have a chance of parrying 15% if there is one attacker. If you have parry of 20 you will have a chance of parrying 7.5%, if there are two attackers. From Grab Bag: "Dual wielders throw an extra wrinkle in. You have half the chance of shield blocking a dual wielder as you do a player using only one weapon. Your chance to parry is halved if you are facing a two handed weapon, as opposed to a one handed weapon." So, when facing a 2H weapon, you may see a penalty to your parrying. Parry is only possible if they are within your frontal arc of 180 degrees.

Blue Developer Posts: 15821 Joined: Apr 22, 2005 00:00	Reply with quote by Blue » Mar 04, 2010 19:50 I asked about parry when facing Dual wielders. Parry is halved on Uthgard for DW attacks. Sorry to hijack this thread but I need proof that it SHOULD halve parry for DW attacks or the code must be removed. It's done when it's done. Thanks for your patience. Every bug gets fixed. Sooner or later. "It is an inescapable law of nature that the amount of satisfaction one gains from achieving something is related to how hard it is and easy things can only elicit a fleeting superficial sort of pleasure." Blue says, "you used macro tools or macro keyboard" Pala says, "i am disabled. and i have a mechanic left hand that can be programed. its hard to play woith one hand" [Appeal] Bxxxxxxxx: "why is RA first aid cann man i stealth use and not unstealth cann man ra if man use unstealth ?????????" BannedUser: "i was not using automate game action my hand was fall on keyboard during i was sleep .... i was completly fall on keyboard ..."

nixian Forum Moderator Posts: 5450 Joined: May 19, 2006 00:00	Reply with quote by nixian » Mar 04, 2010 19:53 Parry % = (5% + 0.5% * Parry) / # of Attackers # of attackers = 2 when facing dual wield so yes it is halfed (atleast thats always how i understood why dual wield cuts block/evade/parry chances to half) live tests had to be made though to ensure this is true (if it hasn't been changed)

Blue Developer Posts: 15821 Joined: Apr 22, 2005 00:00	Reply with quote by Blue » Mar 04, 2010 20:03 Yes livetests needed. Don't think dual wielders count as 2 attackers in general. They only mention evade rate and block rate. It's done when it's done. Thanks for your patience. Every bug gets fixed. Sooner or later. "It is an inescapable law of nature that the amount of satisfaction one gains from achieving something is related to how hard it is and easy things can only elicit a fleeting superficial sort of pleasure." Blue says, "you used macro tools or macro keyboard" Pala says, "i am disabled. and i have a mechanic left hand that can be programed. its hard to play woith one hand" [Appeal] Bxxxxxxxx: "why is RA first aid cann man i stealth use and not unstealth cann man ra if man use unstealth ?????????" BannedUser: "i was not using automate game action my hand was fall on keyboard during i was sleep .... i was completly fall on keyboard ..."

Toblerone Banned Posts: 1071 Joined: Jan 27, 2010 01:00 Location: Croatia	Reply with quote by Toblerone » Mar 04, 2010 20:19 nixian wrote: Parry % = (5% + 0.5% * Parry) / # of Attackers # of attackers = 2 when facing dual wield so yes it is halfed (atleast thats always how i understood why dual wield cuts block/evade/parry chances to half) Crude and simple explanation, but wrong. Parry should in fact have a bonus when fighting against dual wielders and penalty vs 2h. [23:53] <@ref^> i once hugged a girl you know [20:03] <@ref^^> I AM NOT STUPID [20:03] <@ref^^> but i am retardd

Satz Alerion Knight Posts: 1860 Joined: Jun 21, 2005 00:00 Location: Albion	Reply with quote by Satz » Mar 04, 2010 20:29 No defskill has a bonus when facing any enemy(beside lower level). Aswell as evade and parry cap at 50%. Most classes that can spec parry actually do reach 50% quite easy... Ill logic... If parry would have a bonus when facing dual wielders, why shouldnt block or evade have a bonus when facing 2h, then? No patchnote states anything about removing that bonus, so go check live now, if you encounter some kind of valid bonus, it should get implemented then.

Toblerone Banned Posts: 1071 Joined: Jan 27, 2010 01:00 Location: Croatia	Reply with quote by Toblerone » Mar 04, 2010 20:35 Satz wrote:Ill logic... If parry would have a bonus when facing dual wielders, why shouldnt block or evade have a bonus when facing 2h, then? In fact, evade has the same bonus vs 2h that parry has vs dual wielders. 2h in itself also had a small bonus increase to parry chance. This is old research, I remember it from before SI. Unfortunately I doubt we could find any data on it ^^ [23:53] <@ref^> i once hugged a girl you know [20:03] <@ref^^> I AM NOT STUPID [20:03] <@ref^^> but i am retardd

Nymeros Phoenix Knight Posts: 1426 Joined: Apr 12, 2009 00:00	Reply with quote by Nymeros » Mar 04, 2010 20:52 Blue wrote:I asked about parry when facing Dual wielders. Parry is halved on Uthgard for DW attacks. Sorry to hijack this thread but I need proof that it SHOULD halve parry for DW attacks or the code must be removed. Dual Wield SHOULD DEFINATELY NOT halve Parry. That is a fact and that code should be removed as soon as possible. However I personally do not have any sources of it also being increased against Dual Wielders. I'll try to find some and post it here Btw I have to say that it's good to see you checking all this stuff Blue, nice work.

Nymeros Phoenix Knight Posts: 1426 Joined: Apr 12, 2009 00:00	Reply with quote by Nymeros » Mar 04, 2010 21:05 Grab Bag: http://www.camelotherald.com/more/453.shtml 2002-08-09 18:15:38 Q: How do blocking and parrying work? A: Both of these skills use dexterity, and the quality of your shield/weapon, to create a numerical value. That value is compared to your opponent’s weapon skill value to determine your chances to block or parry. If the numbers are equal, your base chance is determined entirely by your skill level. Also, before this comparison happens, the game looks to see if your opponent is in your forward arc – to determine that arc, make a 120 degree angle, and put yourself at the point. Dual wielders throw an extra wrinkle in. You have half the chance of shield blocking a dual wielder as you do a player using only one weapon. Your chance to parry is halved if you are facing a two handed weapon, as opposed to a one handed weapon. Nothing else is mentioned in that grab bag. This could even be used as an argument for that claim many people made that DW wasn't meant to halve evade, especially as it was fixed (to not halve it) in 1.87.