Sounds logical.

Only one thing I am not sure:
Once I was deffing with a few mates a shroomed lord.
We attacked shrooms with AoE (damage and mezz), shrooms attacked us and were mezzed - but Lord did not make a move or a shoot.
Maybe still some shroom were on the lord, but I am not sure.

Sorry for my bad English,
but it is as Antiks described it.
Should I have been killed while shrooming (greetings to the Albion Scouts, Huri and Eff) my shrooms no longer cast after releasing.
But I get the message that the Lord is killing my shrooms.

Greetings Rudra/Irela/Partymonster

Teri wrote:Sounds logical.

Only one thing I am not sure:
Once I was deffing with a few mates a shroomed lord.
We attacked shrooms with AoE (damage and mezz), shrooms attacked us and were mezzed - but Lord did not make a move or a shoot.
Maybe still some shroom were on the lord, but I am not sure.

Hard to for me to say or speculate on what happened in that particular moment, without being there to see it, but if I were to guess I would say one or two things possibly were at play. 1: the animist got scared that you attacked his pets and he moved out of range of the lord ( mush like when a heal class with aggro moves of of range ), or 2: the aggro was already shifted to a heal class that was with the animist and they were also already out of range of the lord. I am of course just guessing since I don't think that I was personally there to see what was going on and to have an accurate estimation of the mechanics at play.

On a side note. I would suggest the tactic that after mezzing / attacking the shrooms from the stairwell to then move your support and casters out onto the backside battlements and move your melee outside the keep on the enemies far side (closest to your support) and attack in concert to push them off the keep.

joshisanonymous wrote:
Glad that you have so much perseverence, but it's this sort of folly that has led to Uthgard's downfall in the first place. Maybe you were willing to put up with exploits when trying to find action on a dead server, but I guarantee you that you are in the extreme minority. I'm still logging in myself, but I'm gone as soon as another stable shard opens. There's no reason to stick around on a server with difficult settings to begin with where the only players left find exploits totally acceptable and the GMs have signed out even when they finally are in a position to capitalize on players not having anywhere else to go. When I and any others who were willing to give this server another shot are gone again because of this stuff, you won't have to worry about people coming here to complain about exploits; all 12 of you left on the server can go back to enjoying them in peace.

I find it ironic that you choose to be so hyperbolic as to say that there are only 12 people that play here when the herald clearly shows that there are on average 12 times that amount online during peak hours EU and at least 5 times that amount for NA peak hours, albeit most of them are new or returning players that are doing mostly pve/crafting/etc and not in rvr currently, yet you are trying to say that people are going to quit or leave because of these things. I doubt that you speak for the entirety of the server let alone the current realm you happen to be on, because there would be more posts on here from other than just you complaining about it or vying for change. Truly sad that you didn't take my last antidotal comment as encouragement to foster a good sense of community and build up the strength needed to overcome the adversity that faces you. It's more of a testament towards the same old same old of those who only care about their own self enjoyment versus the greater community. Those types always scream from on high about how the game is broken and needs to be "fixed" when they clearly didn't try to do anything for themselves to try and change the unfavorable outcome using the strength of the community.

Antiks wrote:

joshisanonymous wrote:
Glad that you have so much perseverence, but it's this sort of folly that has led to Uthgard's downfall in the first place. Maybe you were willing to put up with exploits when trying to find action on a dead server, but I guarantee you that you are in the extreme minority. I'm still logging in myself, but I'm gone as soon as another stable shard opens. There's no reason to stick around on a server with difficult settings to begin with where the only players left find exploits totally acceptable and the GMs have signed out even when they finally are in a position to capitalize on players not having anywhere else to go. When I and any others who were willing to give this server another shot are gone again because of this stuff, you won't have to worry about people coming here to complain about exploits; all 12 of you left on the server can go back to enjoying them in peace.

I find it ironic that you choose to be so hyperbolic as to say that there are only 12 people that play here when the herald clearly shows that there are on average 12 times that amount online during peak hours EU and at least 5 times that amount for NA peak hours, albeit most of them are new or returning players that are doing mostly pve/crafting/etc and not in rvr currently, yet you are trying to say that people are going to quit or leave because of these things. I doubt that you speak for the entirety of the server let alone the current realm you happen to be on, because there would be more posts on here from other than just you complaining about it or vying for change. Truly sad that you didn't take my last antidotal comment as encouragement to foster a good sense of community and build up the strength needed to overcome the adversity that faces you. It's more of a testament towards the same old same old of those who only care about their own self enjoyment versus the greater community. Those types always scream from on high about how the game is broken and needs to be "fixed" when they clearly didn't try to do anything for themselves to try and change the unfavorable outcome using the strength of the community.

What was Uthgard's pop like before Phoenix shut down? What do you think it'll be like after Atlas opens if nothing changes? I think it's a lot more likely that I speak for more DAoC players than you do. I hear a good way to win returning players over, though, is to repeatedly accuse them of lacking perseverence when they point out obvious exploits.

fremster wrote:

Abydos wrote:If you have LOS to place the mushrooms, it is a valid place. If the mushrooms can see a target, that's for them to decide to attack.

The lord should be attacking people with their bow, if they're not and the lord can't reach anyone that's something we need to fix. Hope that clears it up.

That's actually contradictive to what you have said before.

My understanding from a comment you previously made, was that any shroom placed must be attackable via melee mode. This ensures shrooms are not placed on roofs or whatever.

You misunderstand. There's an issue where, say in an open field, Z can be placed off the ground / in the air. The shroom visually appears on the ground but server thinks its in air. Knowingly abusing that is grounds for discipline and can lead to a permaban.

Abydos wrote:

fremster wrote:

Abydos wrote:If you have LOS to place the mushrooms, it is a valid place. If the mushrooms can see a target, that's for them to decide to attack.

The lord should be attacking people with their bow, if they're not and the lord can't reach anyone that's something we need to fix. Hope that clears it up.

That's actually contradictive to what you have said before.

My understanding from a comment you previously made, was that any shroom placed must be attackable via melee mode. This ensures shrooms are not placed on roofs or whatever.

You misunderstand. There's an issue where, say in an open field, Z can be placed off the ground / in the air. The shroom visually appears on the ground but server thinks its in air. Knowingly abusing that is grounds for discipline and can lead to a permaban.

I"m still a little confused about this statement. If the shroom is cast with the Z in the air yet visually lands on the ground, and server thinks it is still in the air, it is abuse? Why would this be the case, is the shroom not attackable?

When animists are learning to put shrooms on keep battlements or any elevated surface there are usually 3 outcomes.
1. shroom is correctly placed on elevated surface
2. error message stating target is in the air and no cast is possible (because Z ball is above the surface not on it).
3. shroom falls to the ground (because cast was not far enough on to elevated surface, yet no in air error message) This is the most common scenario and you will see many shrooms on the floor of keep walls as they were placed incorrectly.

Is #3 technically in the air and bannable for? Again this is my confusion point and want to know why that would be, are they unattackable?

I do remember at one point animists could get ground targets from stealthers up on walls and actually set them a unit above the wall and they could not be attacked. Haven't seen that in years and feel like it was fixed.

joshisanonymous wrote:
What was Uthgard's pop like before Phoenix shut down? What do you think it'll be like after Atlas opens if nothing changes? I think it's a lot more likely that I speak for more DAoC players than you do. I hear a good way to win returning players over, though, is to repeatedly accuse them of lacking perseverence when they point out obvious exploits.

Typical Strawman argument. That point of view speaks more to the point that most of the people that left care about their instant enjoyment rather than the social aspect of these types of games from which most of us derived our initial enjoyment from to begin with. Not to mention you have a GM here on this poet twice saying that its valid gameplay.

Ebbie wrote:I"m still a little confused about this statement. If the shroom is cast with the Z in the air yet visually lands on the ground, and server thinks it is still in the air, it is abuse? Why would this be the case, is the shroom not attackable?

Correct - server 'sees' it in the air, and melee can't reach it -> exploit -> not allowed. The only one who can see the true position of the summon loc is the animist themselves. Therefore, you'd typically get one notice from me, and afterwards if I find it again you're on the ban track for RVR exploiting.

Explanation images here
https://imgur.com/a/N6fqI37

Abydos wrote:

Ebbie wrote:I"m still a little confused about this statement. If the shroom is cast with the Z in the air yet visually lands on the ground, and server thinks it is still in the air, it is abuse? Why would this be the case, is the shroom not attackable?

Correct - server 'sees' it in the air, and melee can't reach it -> exploit -> not allowed. The only one who can see the true position of the summon loc is the animist themselves. Therefore, you'd typically get one notice from me, and afterwards if I find it again you're on the ban track for RVR exploiting.

Explanation images here
https://imgur.com/a/N6fqI37

Thank you for the clarification, makes sense. Very nice artwork too

Abydos wrote:If you have LOS to place the mushrooms, it is a valid place. If the mushrooms can see a target, that's for them to decide to attack.

You misunderstand. There's an issue where, say in an open field, Z can be placed off the ground / in the air. The shroom visually appears on the ground but server thinks its in air. Knowingly abusing that is grounds for discipline and can lead to a permaban.

Ok fair enough. My issue though is still valid, and maybe it would be beneficial if you could clarify that scenario.

Is it legal to place shrooms in a position that cannot be hit from melee? For example on the roofs in Hib keeps, or halfway up the wall above the doors.

Antiks wrote:

joshisanonymous wrote:
What was Uthgard's pop like before Phoenix shut down? What do you think it'll be like after Atlas opens if nothing changes? I think it's a lot more likely that I speak for more DAoC players than you do. I hear a good way to win returning players over, though, is to repeatedly accuse them of lacking perseverence when they point out obvious exploits.

Typical Strawman argument. That point of view speaks more to the point that most of the people that left care about their instant enjoyment rather than the social aspect of these types of games from which most of us derived our initial enjoyment from to begin with. Not to mention you have a GM here on this poet twice saying that its valid gameplay.

Right. It's always other people's personally failings. Never anything else. You're just better than everyone; that's why you're still here.

Hi there,
After the statement and the impressive pictures from Abydos, I immediately started a test.
There were an animist and a Warden / Menti with whom the test was carried out.
Neither an Albion player nor a Midgard player was injured or killed.
The videos should refute Abydos' statement that the mushrooms are meezable, attackable in close combat mode and attackable / killable with magic.
If this is not enough, I am available for further tests.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m66TX7iGi8U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlW1TiV7dSw

Greetings Rudra/Irela/Partymonster

were you dual logging? It is not allowed

It is possible we put in some workaround to fake-plop animist shrooms down on the ground with the player (Genjiro did you work on this last?). The point stands, if they couldnt be attacked by melee on the ground what you've demonstrated is an exploit. OR if from the ground they can attack the lord (because they cannot see the lord)

Though as displayed, with them attackable in melee, no issue was made

No, I don't do dual logging, the other player was a Gildi from Eponas.
He doesn't have that many 50's to test.

If you need an animist or other characters to test please contact me.

Greetings Rudra/Irela/Partymonster