Seyha wrote:No one here has answered my question:

If everyone can have buff pots/charges, then what is the point of having them?

The point is granting groups that do not have the required buffing classes in their setups a relatively equal chance fighting opponents of the same strength. (FG and smallman RvR mostly)

This also changes the in RvR situation from one without buffpots and charges to a setting where it will become required even when both sides theoretically could do without because you CAN get them. This situation differs from having buffbots because nobody should ever be supposed to have buffbots, since it requires logging two accounts. It is not an ingame advantage you can take to beat your opponent, which should be ruled out imo.


Your argument that it's a grind is kind of ridiculous since everything you do in order to get ready for RvR is basicly a grind. Getting your very own selection of buffs and charges is just that aswell, you could call it an extension of your template.
Not to mention that, just like a template, it allows you to personalise your character even more. Well used charges and pots can mean a serious advantage in battle and bring extra depth to the gameplay. Yes you will lose without them, but you will also lose without a decent template.

It's just part of the game imo and it's not actually harming as long as they accept that fact.


The 'imbalance' they create is definately smaller than the balance possibilities it creates. Even self buff classes can use charges just as good.

[quote="Braxis]
It's about options.

The more you have, the more ppl will come here to play and we'll have a bigger community.

Taking them away will just cause more ppl to quit if they can't play the way they want.[/quote]

/signed
We need more options to encourage alternate playstyles.

I like to take and defend keeps. I've never had a stealther class in 10 years. But that's just me. I respect others right to play the game as they wish.

Kaltess wrote:

vangonaj wrote:Buff pots and charges ... make the game more social ...

LOL
It's very social to prefer playing solo with pots,compared to play with a support player.

I mean economy, trades...

When i want play in group, i play my healer or skald. When i want play solo, i play my sb, and i need pots for fight vs gimps who only can play in duo with suporter because they cant kill solo lev 30 enemie.

Personally I still think my solution would make it more enjoyable to play solo without removing charges and pots 100%

1. you get less stuff you have to /use in a cycle to just be able to run out
2. you still get the possibility to buff up to fight a duo if needed
3. you don't loose a possible income for alchs
4. you get more value for your money (normal live values on charges)


and just to say my idea again:

basically:

charges = timer 1
buff potions = timer 2
heal potions = timer 3


timer 1 = 5 minutes
timer 2 = 5 minutes
timer 3 = 1 minute

I would too if I were playing a stealth class which has buffs.

Try putting yourself in the shoes of some visible class you want to go solo with.

Post/charges were nerfed because of a long gone situation in agramon.

I say bring them back to live values in time, cost, and delve!

Considering the current situation of OF maps with bottlenecks where stealthers zerg, it would be a welcome sight to all those who dare venture into endgame RvR solo or in smallgrps.

nixian wrote:Personally I still think my solution would make it more enjoyable to play solo without removing charges and pots 100%

1. you get less stuff you have to /use in a cycle to just be able to run out
2. you still get the possibility to buff up to fight a duo if needed
3. you don't loose a possible income for alchs
4. you get more value for your money (normal live values on charges)


and just to say my idea again:

basically:

charges = timer 1
buff potions = timer 2
heal potions = timer 3


timer 1 = 5 minutes
timer 2 = 5 minutes
timer 3 = 1 minute

Why nerf again? Pots and charges were nerfed 2 times. Is enough, why nerf them again?

Why most of people here only want remove and nerf game mechanics? Whe charge bp price was updated at beginig was a little problem, but we had nice solo action and we did bps easily. Now with charge recharge prices and crap solo action is another nerf too. No one think about this?

vangonaj wrote:Why nerf again? Pots and charges were nerfed 2 times. Is enough, why nerf them again?

Why most of people here only want remove and nerf game mechanics?

Shortsightedness.

Just remove pots and charges completely from the game so we can all play melee rangers.

vango if you had read my original post you would know that it includes:

1. going back to old BP prices for recharge
2. upping the value of charges to normal values (75 etc)

so you do a few things

1. you make the charges more powerful
2. limit how many buffs can be worn at the same time
3. limit the stupid buff circle you HAVE to go through as a solo these days because some people need their "semi-bag-bottle-buffbot" to fight 1v1 with another stealther
4. you keep the power of charges but force people to make a decisions on which charges they want to run
5. you keep charges in play so groups can still use charges to even out in unbalanced situations


tbh I see the best parts of both worlds in my setup.. I guess you will hate not being full buffed but only partial... but.. oh well..


ps. @ braxis - I play a NS, druid, and eld in rvr.. so what stealther do I have that have self buffs?

Just remove stat buff charges altogether, if everyone is the same then its balanced It's like being allowed to take performance enhancing drugs in the Olympics :p

LoL taking again pots in disscusion ? i thought we all know already that pots/charges are way weaker than on live (no timer on live etc) and this was a custom change without any logic. Pots are in this game since long time ago and nerfing/removing them is a custom change.

But yea, like someone said earlier, we could all play melee rangers.

As some of you might noticed, i am preety inactive lately, forced by old frontiers and other personal issues. Staff should understand that the next changes could be the end for some of us on uthgard.

nixian wrote:vango if you had read my original post you would know that it includes:

1. going back to old BP prices for recharge
2. upping the value of charges to normal values (75 etc)

so you do a few things

1. you make the charges more powerful
2. limit how many buffs can be worn at the same time
3. limit the stupid buff circle you HAVE to go through as a solo these days because some people need their "semi-bag-bottle-buffbot" to fight 1v1 with another stealther
4. you keep the power of charges but force people to make a decisions on which charges they want to run
5. you keep charges in play so groups can still use charges to even out in unbalanced situations


tbh I see the best parts of both worlds in my setup.. I guess you will hate not being full buffed but only partial... but.. oh well..


ps. @ braxis - I play a NS, druid, and eld in rvr.. so what stealther do I have that have self buffs?

Back to live like value and old price is nice. But rest that you said is nerf and really big nerf. I prefer stupid buff circle than anther nerf in this server.

And ask your realm mates (rangers and nss) who respeced to blades, changed spec and farmed new template and st/con charge, if they want their work nerfed again?

Runis my friend.. quitting because of pot/charge changes are imo a silly reason.. and OF situation... well.. the more who goes to odins to solo.. the more action you will find /shrug suit yourself old m8

@vango

it might be a nerf.. but its a nerf to everyone.. everyone.. and yes - players with selfbuffs will have an advantage.. but isn't that why they get selfbuffs?

Nixian wrote:1. you make the charges more powerful

No, you just return them to how they were ment to be.
This is still DAoC. Not NixoC.

Nixian wrote:2. limit how many buffs can be worn at the same time

Again custom limitations. Not the way to go.

Nixian wrote:3. limit the stupid buff circle you HAVE to go through as a solo these days because some people need their "semi-bag-bottle-buffbot" to fight 1v1 with another stealther

This is completely subjective. How you call pots is your business.
This is just like: "Lets remove these templates, they are like mini artifacts, because its a hassle to farm them!".
So this wont fly either.

Again youre looking at this only from your tunnle vision point of view.
Not all of us play stealthers.

Nixian wrote:4. you keep the power of charges but force people to make a decisions on which charges they want to run

Which again mostly benefits the classes who can already buff up on their own.
Again, forcing ppl is not the way to go in any sane society.

Nixian wrote:5. you keep charges in play so groups can still use charges to even out in unbalanced situations

These changes affect mostly solo/smallman situations, so keep fg out of this.

Nixian wrote:tbh I see the best parts of both worlds in my setup.. I guess you will hate not being full buffed but only partial... but.. oh well..

Fortunately this is only your point of view.

Nixian wrote:ps. @ braxis - I play a NS, druid, and eld in rvr.. so what stealther do I have that have self buffs?

Sry I meant visible soloer.

Its a whole different word then being solo n stealth or in a fg/zerg...

On one hand we could have livelike changes that would better balance this server, being dismissed as not livelike because they're past 1.80 (even though some still exist, like remedy for all stealthers etc.).

On the other hand we have completely uthlike custom changes that are dismissed by the staff as being custom changes (:roll:), they only refer to them as a "necessary greater good" when in fact very few custom changes actually aid the gameplay itself, most are crippling and annoying. Those that were actually good and useful (like porters in starting towns, instant teleport into rvr zones) were removed because they "weren't livelike". The only single custom change that I actually like and find useful is the implementation of barrels. Every other custom "greater good" for the sake of "balance" doesn't really help gameplay but has an opposite effect.

When making custom changes either try to listen to the players as well or don't make any at all (or what's worse don't deny you made them) as it only creates further chaos, just a suggestion ^^

P.S. by aiding gameplay I mean making it less dull, not easymode. Useless and pointless timesinks do not make the game any harder, only force us to spend more time on the same task (and since there's no monthly fee for playing uthgard, what is their actual purpose?).