M00n wrote:Maybe you already have long term plans, but who care? We want get fun today not a year later.

Pay fulltime workers and you will have fun faster.

Haldan wrote:Hello community,


RealmAbility-System and GameMechanics:

Lately there have been a lot discussions about RvR balance, caster balance and other balancing issues. Many of these issues seem to result of our currently used NewFrontiers RA-System. We spent a long time discussing this issue and agree to the proposal that the Classic RA-system is the solution to these balancing issues. Furthermore to say we believe that the classic RA-system will offer a more classic feeling of gameplay due to the fact that each realm would have it's own RA-specialities.

This statement is not yet a valid "go" for the old system, but a promise that we are going to check the possibility of implementing the old system ... you know we love testings and while testings on old RAs are no longer possible, we will have to do research on the camelot herald and a lot other ressources. *addiotnal edit* The implementation of the classic realm abilities would of course in addition force us to set patch 1.65 as standart for character changes!



Live long and in prosper
Your Staff

Hello..


Uhmm.... WHAT?! Is this true?! (checks date for april fools.. )

That's just plain AWESOME if you ask me. Together with the new patch goal omg *drools* damn, if this comes to life here on Uthgard I'd be even more excited to play here.
Seriously one of the best news reports I've read since I'm playing here. Hmm well besides that we're using NF instead of OF, but oh well everything at it's time I guess . Great to see the staff actually having the courage to take the next step towards a REAL Classic server.

Don't take me wrong however. Old RAs is no joke to implement, let aside certain imbalances it might create.
BUT, I think that the Uthgard staff (with help from the community) knows good enough what goes and what not. I rather have a CUSTOMISED -Yes, I would like customising features that are OBVIOUSLY Flawed/OPed-, Old RA setting (like giving Hybrid tanks the New RA DET spec, while giving the full tanks the Old RA setting.) more than a complete New RA setting.
I believe that Old RAs are the golden in-between if customised in the right proportions. It's obvious that Old RAs almost excludes some classes from the group setup or favors certain classes over others, but I think there definately is a way to make this all more reasonable and acceptable and in the end more fun to play.

KEEP IN MIND HOWEVER, that staff should be VERY carefull when reading proposals and edits, since some people do not think further than benefitting their own class above game balance, which can be lethal. But I think that, from what I've heard from the staff, there is no need to fear on this part since every change gets talked trough a lot of times before actual work starts.


Anyway, with the good -correction, the Awesome!!-, also the in my opinion not so good.
I'm talking about the planned changes for Agramon and the surrounding zones. I really think Agramon needs more love than just XP increase for a couple of reasons:
- lvl 50 RvR is NOT based on killing XPers, at least, it shouldn't. It should mainly be driven by lvl 50s fighting eachother. The fact that there are XPers out there should be a extra boost, not the engine itself.
- XP bonusses do not affect the long travel times between frontier zones (Agramon) and in no way make up for that, especially not at low peak hours.
- XP bonusses do not attract more 50s to come RvR.
- XP bonusses do not create better hotspots for smallgrp action.
(For instance homekeeps: when holding the towers it's possible to camp it, HOWEVER, there's 2 options for people that come out: either walk to Agramon (probably XPers or speeder classes) Or take the horse / boat. The real problem here is, is that the boat is totally separated from the route to Agramon. There's no way you can camp the keep and be aware of everything that comes out, let alone kill or attack them, especially if you have no speed (Hastener > you) which forces you to let incs that go the other way go. This simple fact actually destroys a lot of the incs because you have to decide what route to camp. Camping the route to Agramon is just not viable because A) a lot of other soloers/smallgrps take boats (means u lose those incs) and B) because FGs and larger grps also pass those routes, making it hard or impossible for non-stealtehr solos to camp that spot/route.)

I would suggest at least 2 more changes to increase the RvR activity.

1* Not 1, but 2 towers in enemy hands prevent players from porting to homekeeps in order to make it more attractive and reasonable to solo or run small groups. (Solo action dies out when the enemy realm(s) cant port to the keep because it's just in no way rewarding to camp boat dropoff points since people can jump at any given time. It's also just not viable running to teleport keeps because it takes ages and probably gets u killed by realm guards after 1 or 2 incs. I see this as a major issue tbh. Taking one tower is DF related 60%-70% of the time and has a HUGE impact on the RvR supply chain, which is a bit exaggerated atm imo. Taking a tower more if attacking the keep itself or the relic on the other hand should be no problem, since that force will be large enough anyway. I think it's necessary to give this mechanic some lowpeak/small action love. Let the DF tower actually be just a DF tower, but don't let it destroy the RvR action for such a large part.)

2* Relocate the docks to be on the (horse)route to Agramon or turn the keeps so that the route to the docks is largely colinear with the (horse)route to Agramon. (Maybe turn the keep a bit if possible, or just relocate the docks, or a combination of both.) This significantly increases the inc for solo's small groups. They will now have a decent hotspot with several places to hide (water, edges, behind towers, ...) which allows them to be relatively safe from FGs, but ready for targets. Stepping into the RvR zone will again require a bit more caution.)

(3* Re-Implement A NEW (not 'the') Agramon teleport system without camps, not where the camps used to be, but further back, between the bridges and cata towers. Use the random spot teleport system (possibly with 1 - 2 roaming guards and/or timed porting). !!!Maybe only unlock this at lowpeak hours (makes sense imo, it will give a nice boost for players that doubt staying just a bit longer because incs are becoming hard to find). Make sure that capturing 1 tower prevents the Agramon porting. If the changes above are taken in, there should only be a slight fallback regarding action when 'the DF tower' is taken, instead of more than a whole zone (part of Agra + whole frontier zone), like it is now. If the port is static (also on peak hours) then capturing 1 tower would easily be a way to enlarge the RvR zone, if someone feels the need for it).)



Anyway, thanks so much staff for this update, very much appreciated by me and I'm sure loads of other players. I hope you consider my proposals once more and try to catch the reasoning behind it . I try not to mindlessly propose changes for my own benefit but think of what would benefit the SERVER and RvR in a whole.


Peace,
~Zrawkor, Vanquish GL


((PS: In the long run I'd vote for OF, but I don't really see that as an option yet, I believe Uthgards population needs to increase even more for it to be really usable.))

Pay fulltime workers and you will have fun faster.

I would if it would worth it

Nayru wrote:

M00n wrote:Maybe you already have long term plans, but who care? We want get fun today not a year later.

Pay fulltime workers and you will have fun faster.

Nice suggestion Nayru. M00n, send us some money and we may work faster

Pay me and I will fix the whole server

If uthgard devs are willing to do all this hard work, id suggest going ahead and working on getting ToA , MA, and maybe the zone. The agrument was old ras because no toa, i think it would be less work to just add toa stuff. Maybe not exactly the same as live, but find away to work it in , slowly. Like MA does effect some classes alot, for example the rangers get Phase Shift and Zepher or how ever its spelled lol. Both great for stopping damage on you and Zepher being good to get your enemy away from you, to start bow damage again. And for caster brittle guards and stuff. I like the toa idea more then old ras. I wouldnt mind just having MA added, and maybe items with toa bonuses, forget artifacts lol. but that would be up to you.

now i know you dont like custom things to add stuff, but your also talking about old ras and implementing them on a guess. Also old ra, new frontier, that would be custom too.

Now these people that want old ras, really need to look into it. They may like what they get, but do they know what they will have to deal with also. Like for example poor archers will be screwed on stealth vs assasins. No mos, and assasins get mos and detect hidden. many classes can increase the attack speed, draw speed, cast speed and it doesnt effect damage. Are you guys really sure this will improve balance, and if so for what classes. Remember, no bias.

Eclipsed wrote:The agrument was old ras because no toa, i think it would be less work to just add toa stuff. Maybe not exactly the same as live, but find away to work it in , slowly.

Never! You will never get to see all that trash on this server.

nixian wrote:also - the timers would be waaay too big on active RAs to be viable in the "fast" rvr setting we have in NF - in OF you waited for port (15 mins?) + you ran a long way to get to action - that meant that 15-30mins RA timers meant that if you lost they would be up again when u got back to your rvr point and if you won you had to do next couple/many fights without RAs

however - in the current settings this would mean 1/30 fights would allow RAs used which would make them pretty pointless over passive RAs

Nixian, you seem to be forgetting that however action took longer to reach, would also just LAST longer. Some people would actually win fights with or without active RAs, having more fights withing minutes/seconds. There were way more people in RvR, making collisions and fights way more common, partly making up for the "long runs to action". However, there was no need to be able to dump your RAs every fight. Imo it made active RAs less important in fights because they were unreliable. They were a gadget instead of a working tool.

Here's how I see it. No more RA dumping every fight, more tactics and feeling needed when to activate your RA.
People relying on active RAs is something I never liked to be honest. Especially RAs like Charge and SoS.

Zarkor wrote:
Here's how I see it. No more RA dumping every fight, more tactics and feeling needed when to activate your RA.
People relying on active RAs is something I never liked to be honest. Especially RAs like Charge and SoS.

that is true

I guess ill go back to my high CS spec then and go super high passives to PA + CD every caster to death

edit: removed a lot of my QQ and whining about 30 min purge

lets see what time brings and try stay more positive i guess


ps.

really really like this idea

2* Relocate the docks to be on the (horse)route to Agramon or turn the keeps so that the route to the docks is largely colinear with the (horse)route to Agramon. (Maybe turn the keep a bit if possible, or just relocate the docks, or a combination of both.) This significantly increases the inc for solo's small groups. They will now have a decent hotspot with several places to hide (water, edges, behind towers, ...) which allows them to be relatively safe from FGs, but ready for targets. Stepping into the RvR zone will again require a bit more caution.)

Eclipsed wrote:If uthgard devs are willing to do all this hard work, id suggest going ahead and working on getting ToA , MA, and maybe the zone. The agrument was old ras because no toa, i think it would be less work to just add toa stuff.

The opposite is the case. 1.65 and old RA are way more easy to reach than ToA+MA. Beside that ToA has no place here. ToA is against Uthgards concept and will not come. 1.65 + old RA's would fit nicely into the classic settings.

*tips hat*
Thanks guys for the features to come. I was looking forwards the implementation of the mounts in this server. Their speed values seems to be a good tradeoff for classes that don't have some, while pushing people for grouping for a better one (which is, imo, what this game is about).

The xp bonus? More than welcome.

Haldan wrote:- possible introduction of more interesting features such as ressource nodes (under discussion!)

Would you care to elaborate on this feature?



[OFF TOPIC]
Not to add on the negative forum tone related with the latest changes, but I find the behavior of some of the forumers very stunning. The dev community is even more worthy in their work while they face such animosity when trying to improve the server.
Those people shouts a big nono as soon as they're informed about the change, without giving it a chance to be tested, and therefore approved by all the players of the servers who don't post in every thread of this forum (not all of us have time, even though I read a good amount of threads, I can't post in all of them).

The forum is a fine tuning for a feedback, but the best one remains:
the amount of players in game.

I don't care about a few forumers who don't like to see their habits changed. I only care about this ^^.

*looks at herald*
So far, so good


No need to reply to this, I won't go further as I said all I wanted to.
[/OFF TOPIC]

*thumbsup*

Nayru wrote:

Eclipsed wrote:The agrument was old ras because no toa, i think it would be less work to just add toa stuff. Maybe not exactly the same as live, but find away to work it in , slowly.

Never! You will never get to see all that trash on this server.

<3 !

Blue wrote:

Eclipsed wrote:If uthgard devs are willing to do all this hard work, id suggest going ahead and working on getting ToA , MA, and maybe the zone. The agrument was old ras because no toa, i think it would be less work to just add toa stuff.

The opposite is the case. 1.65 and old RA are way more easy to reach than ToA+MA. Beside that ToA has no place here. ToA is against Uthgards concept and will not come. 1.65 + old RA's would fit nicely into the classic settings.

just a question that could bring some more problems ( i love problems)

does it mean that we'll loose spellcraft ( and alchi? i can't live without endu pot ^^)? will we have to farm the rare drops to try to get a decent equipment? but on another side maybe it's better so the casters have a chance to deal correct damages on lower resists.

Spellcrafting & Alchemy were introduced in 1.54.

panachier wrote:

Blue wrote:

Eclipsed wrote:If uthgard devs are willing to do all this hard work, id suggest going ahead and working on getting ToA , MA, and maybe the zone. The agrument was old ras because no toa, i think it would be less work to just add toa stuff.

The opposite is the case. 1.65 and old RA are way more easy to reach than ToA+MA. Beside that ToA has no place here. ToA is against Uthgards concept and will not come. 1.65 + old RA's would fit nicely into the classic settings.

just a question that could bring some more problems ( i love problems)

does it mean that we'll loose spellcraft ( and alchi? i can't live without endu pot ^^)? will we have to farm the rare drops to try to get a decent equipment? but on another side maybe it's better so the casters have a chance to deal correct damages on lower resists.

I personally liked classic Dark Age before spellcrafting, when everyone was different and the glowy weapons were the best People had to work with what they had. But its a romantic vision of the game perhaps, maybe i am strange in thinking so ^^