If you consider letting the player Averok into your guild, know he took his chances during a brief stay in the guild Camelot Unchained to empty the guild vault completely, our guild vault which was mainly filled with level 10-30 items to help lowbies level up, so in salvage and resell value it was a few a few hundred gold at the most, but still a gigantic help to new players.

I am well aware such a thing is not against the server rules, it is up to me as a guildmaster and the fellow players in Camelot Unchained to police our vault.

It is also, from what GameMasters told me, not against rules to make a post like this where I merely state and show facts.

Proof of Averok raiding the guild vault, for your consideration before grouping with him, or worse, letting him into your guild:

This is a post of defamation.

First of all, the guild has not specified any policy of how to use the vault guild.
Second point, I have done absolutely nothing wrong with the taking of the game.
I always put things into it a level beyond 30 in the guild vault, I always helped the guild xp, drop etc..

Now I need these items and I took them.

Please avoid to defame people on the forums, when you do not know the facts, because I have over 10 years daoc played on servers around the world, Italy, germany usa, france and I never had any recall or defamation like this .

You have posted a log where I retrieving the objects from the vault, and then?

Did you ever told us to not use them? no.

Have you ever considered that a guild where everyone can guild people, where everyone can access the resources of a guild can also happen that one take these resources and use them? obviously not.

I am a correct player, who played with me and knows me knows that I do not steal and especially not a jerk like you have written to me in chat, or should I make appeal for free insults? maybe ..

I would like to say one thing about the guild Camelot unchained, first of all Is 50 60 people, but it like empty, people are demanding and those few that help, when happen they have to ask are ignored.
You must therefore always make do with the lfg chat just to kill a boss that takes 2 ppl, so why I have to pay 5% of my money drop, helping to grow a guild that no cares?

In addition: comfortable for you to log in with other people's characters with legendary crafter, you do items with few gold that you make in 50 levels and then many regards.
And who does not have the crafter? , Well the guild crafter wrote to me .. if you push my skald up to 50 I'll do you items for free ..

This is not for me the politics of a guild, in 10 years when one needed in my guild I was giving money / drop without problems and here, from people who play for more time you can not expect more of these posts.

Congratulations Camelot unchained, keep it up, I change the air.

Please "staff" close this post because only give rise to a flame useless.

Sorry for my english too , i had to use Google translat.

Regards Averok

pls stop this witchhunting and shut down this thread...

you can PM yourselves to get along.
anyway if you cant set guildranks correctly... to bad for all.

To avoid anything like this in the first place(or bring it down to a minimum), people should not join 24/7 recruitment spam guilds. Months back Expedient Demise did that, then formed their own alliance with Joint operations(they also recruited 24/7 but out of a different agenda, it was a combination of wanting to make Midgard one big zerg, ruining other people's fun and being stoned out of their minds, in case of JO .

Basically, now you have a group of players(couple of dozens I guess), that have already been through Expedient Demise, North Star, Savages of Nottmoor or what not, and it's obvious that something is not working properly, since they are constantly forming new guilds and having feuds among themselves. Feuds will always happen and people will part ways for one reason or another, but new players should at least try to stay in starter guilds or without a guild for some time. That will give them time to actually meet other players, group with them many times in pve or battlegrounds.

After a while, a group of people that played a lot together will either form their own small guild and not recruit blindly, or they will join an existing guild(preferably a guild where they already know some people and have grouped with members of that guild on more than one occasion). I'm not saying this scenario is perfect, but it builds community in a more stable way and generates trust among players over time.

Funny thing Averok mentioned is that these guilds can't find 6 people to do a raid, and they have 20-30 people online. I've seen that happen with all the guilds listed above(except maybe JO, they are stoned but good, capable players that have enough lvl 50's that are temped and know how to do raids). I've even made a comprehensive DR guide for one of the North star guys. Needless to say, we have yet to see a US time dragon raid on Midgard . Most of them get bored with rerolling twinks, never doing any real rvr, and once they are bored and maybe have one temped character they probably either don't play well or don't have friends to play with, they transfer their plats to another realm and start over.


Really, dunno what Averok did or not, but when you recruit 30-40 people in couple of days and give almost everyone or everyone privileges to recruit, what the hell do you expect xD?

You should thank Averok for cleaning out your vaults LOL!!! Who cares about the rest of the guild when i can sweep A WHOLE VAULT^^

This isn't my experience of CU.

I joined via Freddyshouse as people mentioned that lots of us were joining CU as a guild.
We joined and the guild has been brilliant. Higher levels have crafted for free, offered advice and been good fun. I've leveled easily and have always ended up in a group or having fun with guildies.

I dont know anything about the facts here, but CU has a guild definitely isn't one of those "invite spam guilds". I've never actually seen it advertised in game (ie in the starting zone etc), its just friends of friends I think.

Averok, you posted saying you needed those items, what for? Presumably crafting? Didn't it occur to you that they would be wanted by other loobies?

Firstly, before I get into replying to things here, I'll say that this thread is not about someone breaking the rules on Uthgard (which I never claimed here, as far as I know?), but merely a warning for others who dislike this sort of behaviour; If you do not mind it and welcome it to your guild and ranks, please, ignore it, its all up to you.

Averok wrote:This is a post of defamation.

First of all, the guild has not specified any policy of how to use the vault guild.
Second point, I have done absolutely nothing wrong with the taking of the game.
I always put things into it a level beyond 30 in the guild vault, I always helped the guild xp, drop etc..

Now I need these items and I took them.

Please avoid to defame people on the forums, when you do not know the facts, because I have over 10 years daoc played on servers around the world, Italy, germany usa, france and I never had any recall or defamation like this .

You have posted a log where I retrieving the objects from the vault, and then?

Did you ever told us to not use them? no.

Firstly, for something to be defamation, it has to be a FALSE statement. Nothing I said was false, I stated you emptied our vaults, which you did.

Secondly, we do have a policy regarding the vault: You can take and use stuff from it, as long as you put it back once you are done using it.

Thirdly, I never claimed you did a violation within Uthgards rules, I ran it by the GMs and they said what you did it not against the rules and if you read my first thread, I do not claim you broke the rules.

And I do not see how the length of time you have played DAoC has anything to do with what you did here, or how I am allowed to respond to what you did

Averok wrote:Have you ever considered that a guild where everyone can guild people, where everyone can access the resources of a guild can also happen that one take these resources and use them? obviously not.

I knew that was a risk when I made a vault open to everybody. I am not an idiot who does not know that people can exploit things like this. However, most of the people playing here are not the types to do what you did in my experience, so I am just giving a free warning to others on the server, because while your actions might not be against the Uthgard rules, they might not be acceptable according to the standards of other guilds either.

Averok wrote:I am a correct player, who played with me and knows me knows that I do not steal and especially not a jerk like you have written to me in chat, or should I make appeal for free insults? maybe ..

I am sorry, but I must admit I did loose my temper a bit in the end when you continued to play the victim after explaining you already had decided to leave our guild before you emptied the vault to salvage and sell the context, still, no reason to call you "selfish", as that doesn't accomplish anything except vent my anger

If you don't like the guild, you could just leave, nobody forced you to stay, emptying the guild vault first, thats a jerk-move in my view.

Averok wrote:I would like to say one thing about the guild Camelot unchained, first of all Is 50 60 people, but it like empty, people are demanding and those few that help, when happen they have to ask are ignored.
You must therefore always make do with the lfg chat just to kill a boss that takes 2 ppl, so why I have to pay 5% of my money drop, helping to grow a guild that no cares?

As stated repeatedly in gc motd and on guild website, we currently using our guild due to finance expanding house to get more vault space, crafter npcs and forge/alchemy table set up in guild house and to fund crafters skilling up so they can make stuff for our low levels at cost and hopefully we can end up having crafters able to make level 51 items at a favourable price in the guild some time in the future.

Averok wrote:In addition: comfortable for you to log in with other people's characters with legendary crafter, you do items with few gold that you make in 50 levels and then many regards.
And who does not have the crafter? , Well the guild crafter wrote to me .. if you push my skald up to 50 I'll do you items for free ..

So the crafter, who, in this specific case, did not have a 50 yet, offered that instead of you paying him, you could help him level.

So?

You can say no and you can talk about another price.

I do not see the issue in him offering you an alternative way to pay.

The real unfortunate thing here is that instead of coming to me or an officer with your troubles, you choose to act out and empty the vaults while, according to yourself in PM to me, being angry.
Because according to the crafter you are mentioning, you requested level 51 MP @ cost.
Now, you claim you didn't ask for that, but the way you phrased it to me in PM gave me an idea about what might have happened.
The language barrier.
As you said in PM, and in end of your post here, you use a translator tool to help you communicate in English, and you said you only wanted to ask what the cost of MP would be, which would seem totally fair to ask, unfortunately, it was received as asking for MP @ cost.
I don't know if you asked that first or he made his leveling proposal first, but assuming you sent the message that was misunderstood first, it might just been an ironic reaction to what was perceived as a ridiculous request.
And seeing how it might just been a question of a language barrier, then if you had chosen the path of talking to a Guildmaster or officer about it, then it could have been sorted out and everybody could have been happy with the result, hopefully, but you chose not to take that path.

Averok wrote:This is not for me the politics of a guild, in 10 years when one needed in my guild I was giving money / drop without problems and here, from people who play for more time you can not expect more of these posts.

Again, if we had the money and resources to help you out, sure.

But the guilds resources are still exceptionally limited with the majority not even having reached level 50 yet with a single toon as they have just joined Uthgard after the CU kickstarter, and we simply do not have the funds to sponsor peoples templates; We don't even have the funds in guild treasury to pay for 1 template and if we was to use the funds for that, then who should we prioritize?

It would be mad chaos

Averok wrote:Congratulations Camelot unchained, keep it up, I change the air.

Please "staff" close this post because only give rise to a flame useless.

Sorry for my english too , i had to use Google translat.

Regards Averok

Your English in this post was positively fine and easy to understand, don't worry.

And I do wish you the best in life, I just have no desire to play with you again.

Raggnar wrote:To avoid anything like this in the first place(or bring it down to a minimum), people should not join 24/7 recruitment spam guilds.

Please, Raggnar, if you do see someone spamming for recruitment to our guild, report it to me, as while we are open to anyone, spamming public channels is not something I am fond of and I am sorry if anyone spammed a public channel to recruit for our guild, the guilds concept is built around making a DAoC community for those who backed the Camelot Unchained kickstarter, and is as such, open to anyone who claims they have done so, or who are looking forward to Camelot Unchained, but didn't have the personal economical room to spare money to support it. I know there was some spamming done nearly a month back and I requested it stopped, but as you, and I think others, said here, what do we expect when we invite anybody who wants in?
Someone is bound to be overly enthusiastic.

And I really hope we don't end up like the majority of those guilds you mentioned, if they indeed are as you described them; We are just almost all new to Uthgard and as such, focusing on getting up and ready to actually do RvR, which is also why we left a guild vault open to help lowbies, as we want to help the other newcomers as much as possible to reach level 50 as soon as possible.

Magicco wrote:anyway if you cant set guildranks correctly... to bad for all.

If we had a vault filled with expensive high level drops, I would agree, not setting ranks up for who can and who can't access the vault would be tremendously stupid, but seeing how it was low level items to help people level, setting strict restrictions on who can get the items would defeat the purpose or leave officers having to constantly help people retrieve stuff.

That being said.

/closed