Probably, yes. The setup Holsten suggests relies on basically destroying the enemy group quickly through superior dps, which will likely work against many PUGs. If you try that against a well-played guild group, possibly with double BOF3, I would imagine that you will run into some trouble because if the missing utility.

There are many setups you can play in Mid.

My 4 favourite Setups:

1.
Healer(Trispec -Pac/Mend/Aug- atleast 19 Aug for green Cele)
Healer(Aug/Mend)
Shaman(different specs but instadisease probably the best for most setups)
Warrior(Hammer or splitspec Hammer/Sword)
Bonedancer(splitspec yellow debuff yellow lifetab)
Skald(Hammerspec, SOS,AOM,AOG,Purge etc.)
Berserker(Hammer and Sword/Axe splitspec)
Savage(Standard SVG spec ^^)

2.
Healer(Trispec -Pac/Mend/Aug- atleast 19 Aug for green Cele)
Healer(Aug/Mend)
Shaman(different specs but instadisease probably the best for most setups)
Warrior(Hammer or splitspec Hammer/Sword)
Runemaster (Dark)
Zerk(Hammer and Sword/Axe splitspec)
Zerk(Hammer and Sword/Axe splitspec)
Savage(or second Runemaster)

3.

Healer(Trispec -Pac/Mend/Aug- atleast 19 Aug for green Cele)
Healer(Aug/Mend)
Shaman(different specs but instadisease probably the best for most setups)
Warrior(Hammer or splitspec Hammer/Sword)
Zerk(Hammer and Sword/Axe splitspec)
Zerk(Hammer and Sword/Axe splitspec)
Runemaster(Suppression or Dark)
Bonedancer(Splitspec - yellow lifetab yellow debuff)

4.
Healer(Trispec -Pac/Mend/Aug- atleast 19 Aug for green Cele)
Healer(Aug/Mend)
Shaman(35 Sub, rest Aug)
Shaman(50 Aug for aoe shears, red d/q etc, 20 Mending)
Warrior(Hammer or splitspec Hammer/Sword)
Runemaster (Dark)
Zerk(Hammer and Sword/Axe splitspec)
Zerk(Hammer and Sword/Axe splitspec)

Last- so in that situation an RM is better then?

Basically i'm in a leveling group with a shammy, healer and a zerk.
We'll level together and then probably try and fill the group with guildies/randoms for RvR.

The question is, which of these core groups is better:

Sham
healer
zerk
RM

Sham
Healer
Zerk
Warrior

Sham
Healer
Zerk
Zerk

(I know me playing pac would be best, but I have only done bard and sorc and not particularly keen to try it tbh.

Well,

for the core of 4 players i would suggest:

Healer
Sham
Warrior
RM

I`d rather say:

Healer (pac)
Shama
Warri
Zerker (Assist Leader)

RM is nice to have but for me knowing my Assist leader well is something important. So Zerker beats RM in this situation for me ^_^.

Barlox wrote:I`d rather say:

Healer (pac)
Shama
Warri
Zerker (Assist Leader)

RM is nice to have but for me knowing my Assist leader well is something important. So Zerker beats RM in this situation for me ^_^.

I don't think your reasoning makes a lot of sense. For core players it's better to have a primary cc class, and augh/RM that know how to play with their warrior(which takes time to practice). Having an "assist leader" on this server usually means that all the other DPS will make a macro to assist that guy and blindly stick his target the entire fight. Sure, one person should call out assists, but for any kind of normal RvR everyone should be on TS, and you can call assists there. Many times another berserker will be able to drop something too, so he can call it as well, same goes for RM. I would rather have a picked up zerker, than a picked up RM. Runemaster that plays a lot with the same warrior is definitely more important for the core of the group then some mythical "assist leader" zerker.

Anyhow, you will not always be able to assist. Against many groups, zerkers are nothing more than rupt bots on their assigned targets, characters that are hard to control due to charge/determination/stoicism and that deal constant dmg, drain enemy's power pool and allow the pac to cc the rest of the enemies so RM can start dropping something with warrior. At that point, if enemy support is rupted/cc'ed, zerkers will drop their targets even without assisting, and RM+warr can drop some tanks or an overextended pushing cleric/druid as well.

Why even try at this point? 7 X 1 nearsight class trumps all.

finleyman wrote:Why even try at this point? 7 X 1 nearsight class trumps all.

Seriously stop your Trollposts dude!

So we managed to make a bit of a fixed leveing group with;

Healer
Healer
Shammy
Warrior
RM
Zerk
Zerk
Skald

Perhaps not the fastest group to level, but we thought atleast here we have a semi sorted group if we want to RvR.

If you guys were running this group in RvR, would you change anything?
Is it ever worth switching RM for BD? (interupts rather than NS?) or a second shammy?
Would you keep the skald?

I guess 2 Zerks,Skald,RM is kinda Standard 0815 Setup, but still ok.

I like it also.

You have Speedadvantage mostly versus albs due to the fact you have a Skald (you can SoS in critical moments, have AOTG; Melodies if Skald have higher RR). 2 Zerks Deal good damage + due to the fact you haven an interrupt bot allows the Zerker more often to assist on targets.

Meanwhile RM + Warrior can kill Tanks etc.

You can switch in an BD for an RM, but dont forget you have NS + Bubble + Higher DMG output on an RM then on an BD, and due to the fact you have an Skald , you don´t need an additonal ruptbot in the most cases.

We played similar Setup like, 1 Zerk,SVG,Skald,BD,Warri,SHaman,2 Healer but we used in this Setup the Skald not to interrupt, he assisted always and were the "RR dumper" with AOG,SOS,Melodies.

Nowadays it seems 2-3 RM is standard setup.. argh, that hurts so much^^

2-3 RM Setup is NOT a Standard Setup in Midgard.

Prime is running as Guildgroup a Setuplike 2 RM´1 , 1 BD, 1 Zerk which can work if you are well coordinated and used to play together.

Same with groups i mostly build at the moment, when we are running 3 RM. That happens not often, due to the fact the RM´s need to play very good, especially the Debuff RM, which has the important´s part of picking targets, switching it etc.

Midgard ist not an Caster-Realm, well player RM´s are very rare, so if you are going to build such setups, please don´t think it will work if u start running it the first time.

If i build this groups i know every player, which i invite and know how he play. That´s not the same like u invite "randoms".

Anyway as i said at the Start of this Thread there are several Setups you can play on Midgard due to the fact yu have only 4 Slots your really need (Pac,Aug,Sham,Warr) rest you can fill up.

Last time e played even a Setup w/o warrior, fullpush Setup, like 4 Zerks , Skald, well sometimes funny if your opponents dont have bof otherwise they will just let your healer explode after all DI and instas are gone ^^

Get a pac, aug, shm, war. Then fill up with runies and zerks.

A zerk or runie is always better than a skald, bd or svg.