Nymeros wrote:They have nowhere near the absorption of plate armor, let alone better.

The abs buff isn't simply added, it's a complex formula which leaves VWs with about the abs of scale armor, or little worse than that.

wat?

Absorb:
This is your primary defensive buff. Having only cloth, you have exactly 0% damage absorption. Coupled with low life, this makes you very, very weak. To make you more sturdy, you get a nice absorption buff. This buff starts at 5% at 5 Spec, and ends at 33% at 34 Spec. As a Valewalker, you should always have at least 34 Spec in Arboreal Path for the 33% absorb buff. 33% is the same as Alb Plate armor, except Cloth doesn't have the same Armor Factor.

please shpw me this formula you speak of

Armor Factor Buff:
This will be your primary unspecced defensive buff. It will add a great deal to your Armor Factor, and believe me, as a cloth wearing hybrid, you will need it. Your AF will be extremely low, and even with this buff it won't go above 500. With AF cap increases, you can make this a tad higher. The last one at level 50 delves for +250 AF

I can't show you the formula because I don't know the formula, and I don't know anyone that does. I can only tell you what I know from playing a Valewalker on live, and that is that they DO NOT HAVE nothing like the abs of plate armor with the abs buff.

There is more to DAoC then simply googleing class guides, but even if you just google you might try to do it with a little more effort:

The 33% absorb buff is the best of its type in game. However after much reading and debate the only thing I can tell you, without rampant speculation, is that the combination of AF and absorb is good, but unlike the 33% absorb might suggest our ability to take damage is not what the 33% absorb might suggest. My best guess is that we are close to scale in terms of our ability to absorb damage overall, possibly a little less (subject, of course, to the rampant speculation I was just taking about).

The absorb buff will raise your armor absortion rate from 0 to the level listed on the spell (it won't be as good as plate armor due to several reasons but it will be close enough)USE IT, maximum level is gained at 34 Arb for a 33% abs.

P.S. I am glad you agree with the rest of my post.

i did google, and i also know where you got that info from, so dont think that i didnt put forth any effort.

all i asked was if you knew the formula, i even googled that but nothing really came up.

so we posted 2 different things from 2 different sources but we cant prove that yours is correct, especially on uthgard since they like to give spells different amounts than what they delve for, and we cant prove it incorrect either. but that doesnt mean that it is most likely correct, for whatever reason...i question mythic sometimes..

excuse me for being under the impression, until now, that absorption spells simply added the delve amount

We can in fact easily prove mine is correct (or *more* correct at least) simply by going to live and testing. Or at least someone who wants to be sure can. Also you can just ask anyone who ever played a VW (or fought one, lol) do they feel they have plate-like absorb. ^^

The formula is simple, when you take damage in melee that damage is modified down by your armor factor (this is the part with a weird formula), your absorption (and VWs have 33% ABS with the last buff, almost equal to plat ABS), and then your primary, and finally your secondary resists.

As was stated before, the reason that VWs take more damage than an armsman or paladin, even though they have about the same ABS, is because plate has WAY more armor factor than the VW can ever get. And the paladin of course has his own AF buff too. Since AF checks first, its also the most influential for a given amount of reduction.

In my own experience, I tend to hit valewalkers for about the same as I hit heros, or maybe a little less since I get a bonus to hero armor. I've looked at my dmg after fights with VWs and I always hit them for less than I hit BMs, and Heros are about the same. That's my experience.

Atm i would still run hybrid with:

Bard Druid Druid Hero Eld Ench BM , but i would try vw on last spot instead of second bm. Bigger Hits are harder to heal and he does more dmg against pd/bof. Maybe worth a try. Else its just 2 Bms.

Nothing stronger than 2 tanks and Ench/Eld on hib.

Thalien wrote:Atm i would still run hybrid with:

Bard Druid Druid Hero Eld Ench BM , but i would try vw on last spot instead of second bm. Bigger Hits are harder to heal and he does more dmg against pd/bof. Maybe worth a try. Else its just 2 Bms.

Nothing stronger than 2 tanks and Ench/Eld on hib.

There is. 2 Light elds, you definately need more rupts than just 1 eld that also needs to assist once in a while. Besides Nearsight is still imbalanced so better make use of that as long as Hib is unerperforming.

Bard
Druid
Druid
Hero
Light Eld
Offensive Tank
Offensive Tank
X

X = Offensive Tank/Bard/Druid/Light Eld/Enchanter

Thalien wrote:Atm i would still run hybrid with:

Bard Druid Druid Hero Eld Ench BM , but i would try vw on last spot instead of second bm. Bigger Hits are harder to heal and he does more dmg against pd/bof. Maybe worth a try. Else its just 2 Bms.

Nothing stronger than 2 tanks and Ench/Eld on hib.

Or change your vw slot for ment and play full kite grp with 2 peeling tanks bm/bm or hero/bm), working well too

edit: oh wait... hibs cant kite...

Well we ran 3 caster setup on agra but i think we did better when we changed to 2 bm ench eld.

With 3 casters youre too squishy and vulnerable to mid tank split sos/charge.

And you got no dmg if 1-2 casters are rupted.

With 2 tanks as second train you got steady dmg/rupt.

2 Elds could be nice but with ench you got backup speed (underestimated), pet for rupt, and caster do actually some dmg when they are free.

Sure its hard to rely on one Eld for rupt but imo it isnt much better with 2.
With hybrid you got steady rupt/dmg of the 2 tank train and then additional rupt of bard/druid/eld and in best case also some ench/hero/eld dmg on enemy tanks Think thats enough.

Imo the main problem with those setups on hib is that you get 40 second mezzes with only one demezzer and no warden resists.. Last time I played in such hib setups we were dead everytime the bard got mezzed and had purge down (no more endu and no demezzer for 40 seconds)

Hedra wrote:Imo the main problem with those setups on hib is that you get 40 second mezzes with only one demezzer and no warden resists.. Last time I played in such hib setups we were dead everytime the bard got mezzed and had purge down (no more endu and no demezzer for 40 seconds)

Clearly because a Mentalist doesn't fit into their theorycrafting.

Group purge will fix this issue

Well sure its a big problem but hard to get ment or warden into hib setup.

BM x3
HERO
ELD
DRU
DRU
BARD


profit.

IF and when old RAs are put in, this setup will dominate, because the idiotic over extending no charge having zerks will become fodder.

Brooms wrote:BM x3
HERO
ELD
DRU
DRU
BARD


profit.

IF and when old RAs are put in, this setup will dominate, because the idiotic over extending no charge having zerks will become fodder.

A lot more setups will perform well with Old RAs. Even PB setups can be viable.