Is Satore the Name of the Merc or Setgroup?

Dont get me wrong...

Why bother with shield on merc when you have anytime 6 second stun that does 300-600 damage to your target + you don't have to bother with drag and drop switching. For soloing yeah slam is good (also shield with uthgard's awesome blockrate) but in group I'd always go for damage.

Disdain wrote:Why bother with shield on merc when you have anytime 6 second stun that does 300-600 damage to your target + you don't have to bother with drag and drop switching. For soloing yeah slam is good (also shield with uthgard's awesome blockrate) but in group I'd always go for damage.

Thanx someone got the point finally!

that depend of your group. Soem groups play only with mercs in the assist. In this case, yeah, its a good idea one of the merc can slam.

Others groupe have a reaver in the assist. In this case, the group loose dome dps if you're spec shield.

None spec is good or bad, that depend just of your group. Now, if you dont have the same group every day .. you have to make a choice by yourself.

Disdain wrote:Why bother with shield on merc when you have anytime 6 second stun that does 300-600 damage to your target + you don't have to bother with drag and drop switching. For soloing yeah slam is good (also shield with uthgard's awesome blockrate) but in group I'd always go for damage.

It's not "anytime", it's the second style in a chain. Also, have you ever tried landing two consecutive styles on a target that's guarded?

Healowner wrote:It's not "anytime", it's the second style in a chain. Also, have you ever tried landing two consecutive styles on a target that's guarded?

Should be the same succes rate as a slam (dex based) without any to hit Bonus...

Healowner wrote:It's not "anytime", it's the second style in a chain. Also, have you ever tried landing two consecutive styles on a target that's guarded?

No, why would I attack a guarded target knowing full well how op guard is on uthgard? However based on my experience it's a lot easier to land 2 consecutive styles when dual wielding (seeing as how it penetrates block and evade) than just one slam.

The fact is that you do not lose any damage while using DW styles (which should be used anyway because they have a higher GW) and you get a 9 sec anytimer Stun and the ability to guard a target (which is not really often needed as a merc but nice to have).

So it is more like "more utility with slam" vs. "more comfortable play without changing weapons" and not about damage.

Err, yes it is because you lose a lot of damage with slam. Slam itself doesn't do much damage (100ish, it misses a lot and can easily be evaded or blocked. Also by using crush stun you can spec 2 damage types meaning you always do full or bonus damage depending on your target.

Disdain wrote:Err, yes it is because you lose a lot of damage with slam. Slam itself doesn't do much damage (100ish, it misses a lot and can easily be evaded or blocked. Also by using crush stun you can spec 2 damage types meaning you always do full or bonus damage depending on your target.

This is the case, right. But with slam you have the chance to use more side positionals on your target which should balance the damage of the two specs. This is also supported by the fact, that you have a very short delay while changing from shield to DW if you are using a fast shield.

Galdarn wrote:

Disdain wrote:Err, yes it is because you lose a lot of damage with slam. Slam itself doesn't do much damage (100ish, it misses a lot and can easily be evaded or blocked. Also by using crush stun you can spec 2 damage types meaning you always do full or bonus damage depending on your target.

This is the case, right. But with slam you have the chance to use more side positionals on your target which should balance the damage of the two specs. This is also supported by the fact, that you have a very short delay while changing from shield to DW if you are using a fast shield.

If we count peas now - the Stun Immunity from Slam is much Higher and make a Purge more efficient!

Arzt wrote:

Galdarn wrote:

Disdain wrote:Err, yes it is because you lose a lot of damage with slam. Slam itself doesn't do much damage (100ish, it misses a lot and can easily be evaded or blocked. Also by using crush stun you can spec 2 damage types meaning you always do full or bonus damage depending on your target.

This is the case, right. But with slam you have the chance to use more side positionals on your target which should balance the damage of the two specs. This is also supported by the fact, that you have a very short delay while changing from shield to DW if you are using a fast shield.

If we count peas now - the Stun Immunity from Slam is much Higher and make a Purge more efficient!

What else than arguments could I offer to show that you do not lose damage but win utility with shield?

the only reason not to have slam is being lazy.

it´s fine if you are, but pretending you aren´t just makes you look stupid.

Agree with the above 2 posters. Here's why 42 shield > 50 weapon:

- 9s anytime stun > 6s 2-chain stun
- Equal damage output assuming only using DW styles
- Access to Guard (useful for smaller fights where there is no Paladin)
- Access to Medium shield for defence if a tank train decides to jump on you
- Access to Engage for 1v1 / archers

Finally, no experienced tank will rely on slam for damage. The ideal config is to use the fastest shield so you can re-slam at the fastest speed possible if it misses. Also to have the offhand swing at 1.5s for breaking BT. Consider these scenarios:

- 50 weapon merc runs up to caster. First hit -> BT. Second hit -> 1st crush chain. By now a good caster would have quickcasted CC and will be sprinting away
- 42 shield merc runs up to caster. First hit -> BT. Second hit -> 9s stun.

I played a Hero on live pre-Cata and am currently playing a Zerker. I am sorely missing the utility of having a shield for the reasons stated above.

Voloxy wrote:- 9s anytime stun > 6s 2-chain stun

50 Crush
Fullbuffed Half Ogre Merc RR1L1 -> 2008 WS
Bludgeon -> Normal To Hit Bonus, Low Endu + Damage
Concussion -> Normal To Hit Bonus, Normal Endu + Damage

42 Shield
Fullbuffed Half Ogre Merc RR1L1 -> 1658 WS
Slam -> No to hit Bonus, High Endu + no real Damage

Voloxy wrote:- Equal damage output assuming only using DW styles

Excuse me, but i think u guys are pretty WRONG here, 51 Composite Specc only give you the maximum Defense Penetration (Evade/Block/Parry) but NOT the same Damage output as 50+11+RR Weaponskill! The Weaponskill (WS) which is pretty low always calculated against AF, on Live u need to have around 3x Targets AF in my experience to come close to cap Damage with a Tank! Lower WS means lower Damage, got it?

Voloxy wrote:- Access to Guard (useful for smaller fights where there is no Paladin)

Armsman with 50 Crossbow can rupt Caster when u dont have Theurg/Cabalist in Group, so Crossbow Armsman can be pretty good! (Hope u got the point)

Voloxy wrote:- Access to Medium shield for defence if a tank train decides to jump on you

Just press rr5 Button and be happy u just fight a bunch of noobs

Voloxy wrote:- Access to Engage for 1v1 / archers

Do we really speak about 1vs1 Situations here?