RonELuvv wrote:Hey Gregross, when I was comparing Friar and VW I wasnt comparing their abilities or the way they play at all. I was using Friar as a comparison since they are very good solo classes and not quite so good in groups. Not for the same reason, but they fall in the same category.

i see what your saying , but IMO VW is more useful then friar because of there dmg output if anything.. friar isnt really useful because there skills are off par compared to a cleric and there staff fighting abilities are weak and do little dmg ive soloed every friar ive ever seen , or steam rolled them with a group there just not good at all IMO.

Wierd.. cuz i remember on live they were very popular and quite powerful for a hybrid... not sure what happened here

well ppl are just to ignorant to see the potential of friar.
friar makes alb grps as hard killable as hib ones with warden and additional you get heat resis that are very good vs both caster at's

if resi debuff bug gets fixed somewhen you will see more friars in alb grps (with 26% resi and red 50% debuff you stay on 1% resi because of 50%50% split and no cast resis included)

Comparing warden to Friar is like comparing a knife to a sword, yes both can cut an be usefull, but warden adds so much more utility to a grp then a Friar does, and you don´t need to leave out an essential part of your grp.

Warden brings into grp:
Additional resists (one of them is the Body resist which is extremly powerfull against both Mid Mezz and every single damage caster in Alb (not counting Wizard here since Wizards are a joke in Groupplay))
PBT
More heals enable one of your druids to play offensivly, which without a warden is pretty hard to do against most good groups.
Strong RAs (TWF, AoG, even the RR5 is nice if used in a smart way)
Having said that, you need quite some RR to be able to fullfill this role, and theres not to many setups in which a warden really is viable.

What does a Friar add to your grp:
You can fully buff everyone.
Resists (usefull only vs. most mid grps, since most hib grps will debuff the damagetype anyways or not rely on castdamage at all,the eld in a tankgrp has other things to do then deal damage ).
Some heals (if you can heal well, you will not deal damage or vice versa)
A good RR5 ability.
If you want to add a Friar you need to leave out a Cabalist, a Theurg or one Tank. So for Hybrid Grps this is not viable at all (you don´t wanna run with less then 3 casters and you need those 2 damagedealing tanks and the Deftank).
For Tank grps you get gimped damage on one of your tanks, and you loose a Det5 Stoi char for some heals buffs and resists, or you run without the imba rupt of a Theurg.
In a Caster Grp you will loose one of your Cabalists, which will either cripple your damage (debuff cabalist gone) or cripple your utility (only one cabalist that can NS/Desease).
So you always got to treat an essential part of the group, for a class that is only usefull for a bit of survivability. Not a good trade at all.

Friar is just bad , tell me what you'd cut for it

dunno where the warden part came in , we were comparing valewalkers to friars ^^

Resists (usefull only vs. most mid grps, since most hib grps will debuff the damagetype anyways or not rely on castdamage at all,the eld in a tankgrp has other things to do then deal damage ).

yes this is exactly the point i made
atm the debuff mechanism is bugged so you have 1% resis even if debuffed, while you should have -24% gl on healing the 3 man caster at than ...

Well, -24% would be quite rare, but yes.. You should drop below 0% even with capped item resists.. Resist buffs get reduced by debuffs even harder, effectively just adding half of their value when being debuffed.. Well.. If they would be working