Ive been reading around and not much mentions about Norse for a Savage. It all says Troll for top damage and Kobold is also good and Valkyn for good resists. I much prefer the look of a Norseman or even a Valkyn but i dont want to gimp myself by picking one of these races. So the question is the title, is a Norseman good for a savage how worse off would they be if i rolled it instead of Troll or a Kobold and why? Thanks.

Hey,

I think that your race depend of your weapon. To resume fastly and easier, if you think to create a 2H character (sword or hammer for GR) Troll > Norseman > Dwarf > Valkyn > Kobolt because dommage is based on str. However, if you want create a H2H character Troll > Valkyn / Kobi / Norseman > Dwarf because dommage is based on the str and dex.

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Norsemen are great. Even for H2H. If you want to use a 2h go troll though. But if you are H2H Troll/Norse/Kobold are great.

Norse is good. Vale and Kobe are better. Troll and dwarf are worse.

Don't believe that fairytale that troll is the best because he makes a little bit more damage.

Only if u want to use 2H you should take troll.

It goes Valk > Troll > Kobold > Norse

troll>norse all day long with red haste self buff and atleast yellow celerity from aug healer.

there's not a best race for a savage, ofc troll has better ws... but has the worst defence and worst racial resist, with a useless 5% matter.. i personally hate troll for less visibility, it sometimes cover your target and you can't see what is doing

valkin has worst dps while keeping best racial resist, followed by dwarf with a fantastic 5% body resist

norse and koby are more balanced, and keep in mind that with shaman buff you go over 300 (soft cap), with kobby you are not hitting that with str, with troll you leave dex behind (with ranks you hit 300 for sure anyway cause you get aug dex2 for mop and your shaman takes mo arcane so this is not an issue)

Um Valkyn doesnt have worst dps, dwarf does. Valkyn dps is exactly the same as Norse and Kobold.

Due to their resists, valkyns make the best savages.

uhm that's true.. same damage, best resist.. only disadvantage is lurikeen const
remains a personal choice not making a big difference in rvr

The difference that 5 or 10 con will make is basically never going to make a difference whatsoever. Also, since valks do not need to put any points into quickness whatsoever, they can either put the remaining 10 into con or an extra 5 into dext for slightly more damage and parry/evade.

Okay, so let's take Valkyn as an example.

They have a 98 base Quickness. This becomes 173 with SC, 185 with RAs (you'll probably have Dodger at high rank), and I believe 264 with yellow MotA3 D/Q buff. That's an overcap of 14 regarding attack speed.

If I remember correctly, H2H doesn't work as dual wield so only the right hand speed matters. The slowest weapon has 4.0 attack speed.

I don't know which Celerity buff is common on Uthgard, but let's assume you have one Healer with 19 Aug, that's 24% Celerity. Your self Haste buff should be at 32%.

With all this taking into consideration, your attack speed becomes 1.69 without Celerity and 1.09 with Celerity. The cap is at 1.50.

You can easily see why a high Quickness is suboptimal when Celerity is up. You're also losing 14 stat points in the process because of the Quickness cap (or only 2 if you don't get Dodger, but you'll eventually get it so might as well count it). And even more if your healer somehow has more than 19 Aug, or you shaman more than MotA3 / yellow buffs.

All races suffer from this issue to some extend, even Trolls. But Valkyns and Kobolds suffer from it the most, and tend to make them weaker in comparison when Celerity is up.

I thought softcap was 400 as is on live, is it 300 @ 1.65?

I can't find any official source but I believe you're right, it seems to be older than 1.65. I'm removing my comment about that just in case.

quicknes is capped on 250. Other stats i think 400?
btw just for info, here his weapon speed calculator http://www.oocities.org/siliconvalley/p ... n_calc.htm

bm01 wrote:Okay, so let's take Valkyn as an example.

They have a 98 base Quickness. This becomes 173 with SC, 185 with RAs (you'll probably have Dodger at high rank), and I believe 264 with yellow MotA3 D/Q buff. That's an overcap of 14 regarding attack speed.

If I remember correctly, H2H doesn't work as dual wield so only the right hand speed matters. The slowest weapon has 4.0 attack speed.

I don't know which Celerity buff is common on Uthgard, but let's assume you have one Healer with 19 Aug, that's 24% Celerity. Your self Haste buff should be at 32%.

With all this taking into consideration, your attack speed becomes 1.69 without Celerity and 1.09 with Celerity. The cap is at 1.50.

You can easily see why a high Quickness is suboptimal when Celerity is up. You're also losing 14 stat points in the process because of the Quickness cap (or only 2 if you don't get Dodger, but you'll eventually get it so might as well count it). And even more if your healer somehow has more than 19 Aug, or you shaman more than MotA3 / yellow buffs.

All races suffer from this issue to some extend, even Trolls. But Valkyns and Kobolds suffer from it the most, and tend to make them weaker in comparison when Celerity is up.

On Paper i agree with you, but the truth is you will get celerity at inc. After that, you´ll be out of celerity range (1000) most of the time and you might just have your own haste shout. So high quickness isn´t a bad choice at all.